Modern JRPGs vs. WRPGs - Which is better?

WRPG of course. Even tho fromsoft is from Japan, their games don't feel like a Japanese game whatsoever (have you ever seen a Japanese rpg without cheesy cringe and half naked chicks? I haven't), so with them being also a WRPG, JRPG's have no chance. I mean, just look at FF16, they don't even know what the game was supposed to be.

There are multiple definitions of JRPG, and for this thread I'm focused on the games that fit the stereotypical definition of JRPGs, which is why I left out FromSoft games. I've also asked people this question before on JRPG related boards and included FromSoft games when I did - half the thread just turned into people complaining that I included them under JRPGs.

@hardwenzen: Soulslike games play almost nothing like WRPGs. Soulslike games have far more in common with Japanese action-adventures and hack & slash games. Soulslikes are their own genre at this point, but firmly rooted in Japanese game design philosophy.

Disagree. Its more like a arpg in third person than anything made in Japan, and when you take the story and characters into consideration, its even more wrpg-ish than JRPG.

Hmm, I play more western RPGs but honestly split from an objective standpoint. Both have grown quite considerably in recent years. Both camps have a wide spectrum of production values and offer anything from extremely niche to big AAA releases. But JRPGs as a whole use to be regarded as lower production value have been stepping up their game. WRPGs that might have catered exclusively to PC crowds are finding audiences on consoles and I assume both the wider adoption of self publishing and digital distribution have aided in that growth.

But anyhow, play more WRPGs by default but yesterday felt like scratching a JRPG itch. Picked up Star Ocean Last Hope from Xbox 360 which is BC on XSX as I never played it, and I've been eyeing lots of the older FF games on sale on the store for the holidays that have a couple weeks+ left on them.

Been also getting an itch to play some of the Warhammer RPGs available on sale as because I've been loving Darktide. Rogue Trader just came out, but just grabbed Chaos Bane for XSX on sale to try out for now. Stuck a wish list pin in a few others right now for future consideration there.

I prefer JRPG’s more myself but still enjoy a number of WRPG’s.

@hardwenzen: They literally copied Zelda which is Japanese arpg.

Metroid did it first. The genre is called "search action".

They did took a Zelda inspiration, improved by five metric miles, and now Zelda is left behind, constantly saving the princess cuz the ideas at Nintendo are very shallow.

But lets see together at what Souls games improve over zelda, shall we? yes we shall😁

Boss battles are in a completely different dimension when compared to Zelda. Its not even worth comparing them because Zelda boss battles feel like you're still playing on your N64, while Fromsoft boss battles are the best in the business.

Atmosphere in Souls titles is another thing that is so far ahead of what Nintendo can offer on their toaster hardware that its not worth comparing the two. Zelda has zero atmosphere since the GC days.

Enemies design and variety are far far far faaaaaar superior in Souls titles. Again, you can't even compare, Zelda is too far behind.

Level design in pretty much every fromsoft title is as good as it gets in the gaming industry. Nothing approaches to their level design, so again, why even bother comparing to Zelda when Zelda has your standard, generic adventure little video game level design? No point.

Combat system is yet another humongus win for the Souls games. So much so that Zelda feels like a childrens game in comparison.

Thanks to Zelda, Miyazaki The Great has created its own genre, and is now the most copied genre for a decade. This is what we call a truly impactful creator.

I prefer "W" RPG (or "classic") to Japanese or Japanese-style RPGs.

I wish I could tell you why, but the truth is I just don't like the design/aesthetic components of most Japanese games, but especially JRPG's.

And for all the folks saying (or plan on saying) "Hurr durr there's no such thing as a JRPG" or "JRPG is a racist term"....shut up 😋. It's a valid way to classify games, and not meant in any critical sense. It's just a descriptor.

Yeah I feel like JRPG is a very specific thing (Final Fantasy) and most people know that.

Soulsborne games are action games with RPG elements. I wouldn't necessarily call them full-blown RPG's, much less JRPG's.

I mean, would we call Elder Scrolls a cRPG or wRPG? Nope. Then why would we call Elden Ring a JRPG?

Japanese devs have been making third-person ARPGs for decades. If anything, Japanese ARPGs almost always have superior combat systems than Western ARPGs. Western devs are still clueless how to make a decent ARPG combat system.

The story and characters of Dark Souls are way more heavily influenced by Berserk, a Japanese manga, than anything made in the West. Not to mention Soulslike games with feudal Japan settings, like Nioh and Sekiro.

Again, there's almost nothing WRPG-ish about Soulslike games. Hell, they're barely even RPGs. They're more like Japanese action-adventures with RPG elements. The RPG elements don't define the genre. Sekiro, for example, is still a Soulslike despite the lack of RPG elements.

For the sake of your poll, if we are NOT including From Software games then it is easily WRPGs.

Baldur's Gate 3 just released. It got a 97 on metacritic, was at one point the highest rated PC game of all time (still top 5 or so I believe) won the official GOTY, has won the most GOTYs of 2023, won the most awards and the VGA and other sites as well.

In my opinion BG3 is the best non-From RPG of all time. Its certainly up there in the top 5.

Other than BG3 you have Witcher 3, Divinity 2: OS, Skyrim, Mass Effect 2, Mass Effect 3 Fallout 3, Fallout 4, Starfield (lol) in the last 10-15 years.

The only good JRPGs outside of From Software's 6 masterpiece RPGs are Final Fantasy X, Final Fantasy VII and to a lesser extent Final Fantasy 16. The two that are genuine masterpieces released 22 and 26 years ago...

Now if we include From Software, there now are 9 great JRPGs in the last 10-15 years... including Elden Ring, the greatest RPG ever made and Bloodborne, DS3, DS1, Demon's souls that all belong in the top 10-15. (which automatically makes half the list Japanese)

If we're going to make a distinction between JRPG and Soulslike games, then by that same logic:

Baldur's Gate 3 is not a WRPG. It's a CRPG.

CRPG =/= WRPG

Referring to BG3 as a WRPG would be the equivalent of referring to Elden Ring as a JRPG.

Classic CRPGs are made in the West (or Eastern Europe), but they're otherwise a fairly distinct subgenre from modern WRPGs, just as modern Soulslike games made in Japan are a fairly distinct subgenre from classic JRPGs.

I'd place it behind Disco Elysium (which I believe is still the highest rated PC game ever), but the two are pretty strong arguments for "WRPGs" being superior.

Then again, I hate the term WRPG. It's a meaningless categorisation, because it has nothing to do with the style of gameplay.

At least JRPG can be defined as a particular subgenre of RPG - e.g. games that can be traced back to Dragon Quest and Final Fantasy in gameplay, style, and story tropes, with minimal variation on each of those points.

I also think it's telling that Final Fantasy, one of the two defining series of the JRPG subgenre, has mostly abandoned the subgenre.

@Planeforger:

That's why I said it makes more sense to refer to BG3 as a CRPG rather than a WRPG. CRPG is a more specific style. WRPG is a bit more vague, but the term most commonly refers to modern Western ARPGs.

As for Disco Elysium, that could barely be considered RPG. It's much closer to a point & click adventure or visual novel than a typical RPG. The Japanese counterpart to that would be ADV or VN games.

JRPG's come with cringe, poor writing, no story and cheesy characters. None of it is included in fromsoft titles. Fromsoft titles are like Kojima games, it might be made in Japan, but they ain't aiming to release a Japanese game that's for sure.

JRPGs with "no story"? Heavy storytelling is a common JRPG trope. The quality of storytelling is debatable, but claiming they have "no story" is just silly.

Kojima's older stuff was basically straight-up cyberpunk anime. From Snatcher to MGS2, his writing and storytelling was heavily influenced by cyberpunk anime of the '80s and '90s.

Poll is kind of surprising so far, I wouldn't have expected so many people to be placing modern Final Fantasy games and Octopath Traveler over The Witcher 3 and Baldur's Gate 3.

Subjective.

But I like CRPGs like UnderRail where it has ridiculous amounts of depth and open ended gameplay, and doesn't hold you by the hand.

JRPGS, aren't that.

Well yea, story is there, but a teenager could write a better one, and when its accompanied with trash poorly written characters, there might as well be no story, its a damn joke. This is the case in at least 8/10 jrpg's which is really weird because it tells me that the whole country is incapable of telling a story.

Sturgeon's law

90% of everything is crap. That is true, whether you are talking about physics, chemistry, evolutionary psychology, sociology, medicine – you name it – rock music, country western. 90% of everything is crap.

It is entirely subjective and the responses are going to be subjective. Whatever the individual prefers is going to be the one that is considered better. So, what is the point?🤔

Disco Elysium is seriously amazing, definitely better writing than any JRPG ever made. Really hope the devs behind it will do something similar again some day, if they aren't already.

Ahh this old chestnut,along with the *which gaming device should i buy* probably the most asked questions that pc,xbox and ps gamers will say "buy our plastic"and Jrpg and Wrpg fans will choose the one they prefer!

Anyhoo....western because i prefer them and xbox because it has games🤣😂

Has to be JRPGs from me. The only WRPG from that list I like is The Witcher.

Baldurs Gate 3 is not for me. I tried to like it but there's too much wandering round looking for something to do and the combat is awful. Although the reasons I dislike it are reasons why other people love it. I do not like the open-world format anyway.

Can't decide. Love both. A couple of years ago i was on a major Japanese made game run there for ages. So i'm a little burnt out and have moved over to games made in other parts of the world for now*. But lots of really great games to play on both sides.

* er...not that I make my game purchasing decisions based on something as silly as where the game was made.

I classify RPGs by type and not "Japanese" or "Western" because they are more similar to each other than what country they're developed in or what artstyle they use.

• Traditional turned based (Dragon Quest, Persona, Child of Light)
• 3D Action (Kingdom Hearts, Neir, Witcher)
• 2D or Isometric Action (Ledgend of Mana, Hades, Diablo)
• Hybrid (FF7R, Xenoblade, Tales)
• Tactical/Strategy (Fire Emblem, Disgaea, Valkyria Cronicles, Baldur's Gate)
• Soulslike (Souls, Nioh, Lies of P)
• MMO (WoW, FF14)
• Farm Building/Sim (Stardew Valley, Harvest Moon, Altelier)

Japan makes a lot of traditional western games now and vice versa. In different artstlyes too.

Examples = Souls is closer to western action with western art, MMO came from PC but FF14 is the 2nd most popular now, Sea of Stars is a very tradional "Jrpg" developed in the west, Cosmic Star Heroine uses anime art, Dragon's Dogma you'd think it's a western game.

And too many "rpg"s melds into other genres like open world, metroidvania or FPS you can't really define them clearly.

Is Zelda rpg? Is Bioshock rpg? Is Hollow Knight rpg? Is Yakuza rpg?

@JVII: I guess it comes down to gameplay preference. Even if you appreciate the writing, the tasks in game and execution of interaction may interest some more than others.

Are there any games where you appreciated the setting and atmosphere, but don't enjoy playing despite critical acclaim?

Is writing the most important thing in 100% of the games you play?

I appreciate good story too but not all games have to have this for me to be entertained, I can enjoy a variety of styles of game and for a variety of reasons.

JRPGs.

As good as Disco Elysium was. It alone does not carry the mediocrity that is Bethesda, Diablo 4 or Baldur's Gate 3. I also liked Mount and Blade Bannerlord. But man the WRPGs are painfully mediocre.

But Disco Elysium is the best RPG made in well over a decade.

JRPGs by a lot. Problem with good WRPGs is they are few and far between.

Good lord slap yourself JRPG fans

Baldur's Gate III, Disco Elysium, and Cyberpunk 2077 is a holy trinity JRPGs just can't beat.

BG3 is not open world

No, Souls games are straight up western style dungeon crawlers with more Japanese style action. And really, Soulsborne seems to take a lot from Warhammer Fantasy.

depends on your definition of RPG, I'd say souls games have more player agency than most JRPGS that are just straight up adventure games with some number go up slapped on top, nu god of war has more RPG elements and customization than a lot of later jrpg's do, yet we don't call gow an rpg

I like the more strategic approach of typical JRPGs but prefer the world building of the average WRPG. Usually they all bore me before I finish them though.

We've already been over this years ago. Soulslike games are straight-up Japanese action-adventures with RPG elements. They play far more like Japanese action-adventures (e.g. Zelda-like, hack & slash, Metroidvania, survival horror) than modern WRPGs.

Also:

RPG is a genre that's not clearly defined. I think the most accurate definition of the genre would be games that borrow gameplay mechanics from D&D. The "RPG" label itself was originally coined in reference to D&D clones (just as "shooters" was coined for Space Invaders clones, "platformers" for Donkey Kong clones, "FPS" for Doom clones, etc.), so D&D should be the reference point for how the RPG genre is defined. JRPGs (and older CRPGs) mainly borrow combat mechanics from D&D whereas modern WRPGs mainly borrow customization mechanics from D&D, but both are called RPGs because they borrow mechanics from D&D in different ways.

As far as Soulslike games go, most of them have RPG mechanics, but that's not what defines the genre. This became self-evident when Sekiro released. FromSoft got rid of the RPG mechanics, yet it's still the same Soulslike genre as Dark Souls and Bloodborne.

Souls primarily burrows from Berserk.

Dark Souls is Castlevania with depth applied.

They have huge Warhammer influences, especially Elden Ring

The director is a fan of Games Workshop.

I struggle to think of a JRPG I like other than Paper Mario: TTYD. Not a fan of Final Fantasy, Dragon Quest, Persona or the other biggest ones.

Don't really like any western RPGs either. I just play a bunch of action RPGs like Elder Scrolls.

But yeah, overall it's probably western RPGs for me. I find the anime teenager saves the world theme extremely off putting, and that's 99.9% of JRPGs.

I definitely prefer WRPGs personally. There's usually more character customization and player driven choice in WRPGs. JRPGs tend to have more tropes from anime lower production values. There's alot of great JRPGs out there but usually I'd lean more toward Cyberpunk and wasteland 3 over a Tales or Legend of Heroes game.

Source? I've Googled it and found no evidence of Warhammer influence.

Berserk's massive influence on Dark Souls is very well-documented. For example:

Dark Souls Design Works Translation

Dark Souls also references various other fantasy manga, including Saint Seiya, Record of Lodoss War, and JoJo's Bizarre Adventure.

Ultimately, the roots of Japanese RPGs (including JRPG, ARPG and Soulslike games) and fantasy manga (including Berserk and Lodoss) can be traced back to this Japanese fantasy novel from 1979:

Guin Saga

The story centers around a mysterious warrior named Guin, an amnesiac with a leopard mask magically affixed to his head. Remembering nothing but his fighting instincts and the word "Aurra", he confronts a world laden with danger, intrigue, and magic.

30 years later, it was adapted into a 2009 anime with music composed by Final Fantasy's Nobuo Uematsu:

...King from Tekken was also clearly inspired by Guin.

This is the kind of thread I do not engage in because I like both JRPG & WRPG. Both of these genres don't do anything for me, it's all about what "the actual game" does for me!

@JVII: I do not like JRPGs, nor am I a fan of anime.

So, WRPGs all the way for me.

WRPG's, but Lost Odyssey is one of my all time favorite RPG's

Personally, I like good ARPGs, so I prefer Japanese RPGs like Elden Ring, Dark Souls, Nioh, FF16, FF7R, Nier Automata, Monster Hunter World, etc. to those WRPGs listed by TC.

Generally speaking, I prefer quality action combat to clunky combat or dice rolling, depth of level design to pointless wide open spaces, message-driven linear storytelling to piles of choices and text, artistic art design to half-baked realism, iconic and memorable music to wannabe Hollywood soundtracks.

Of course, I'm not saying that Japanese RPGs win on all these things, and many WRPGs do a great job, but personally, in many cases, Japanese RPGs tend to be more to my liking.

Come on guys!! JAPANIMEEEEEE GOOOOOOOOOO

I’m amazed that anyone voted for JRPG. wow

Soulsbourne, Elden Ring, Monster Hunter, Nioh, and Dragon's Dogma are NOT JRPGs.

They do not have the Dragon Quest template or a variation of it.

Just because they are made in Japan does not mean they are JRPGs, and in fact JRPGs have been made in the West and actually, China.