Spider-Man 2: 8/10 GS, 90MC UPDATE: 5 million copies over 10 days!

Naughty Dog: No new games released or even properly shown off in 3 years, no new announcements. Virtually all its talent has left. Factions development looks troubled to say the least. Constantly rereleasing TLOU, with the PC port being a complete disaster. Only thing they have still going for them is all the money Sony pours in. TLOU2 was nowhere near as popular or well recieved as the first. They have gone from a star to a question mark.

SSM: One Trick Pony. And GoW:R left nowhere near the impact of the first game. Just like Spiderman outsells Norse of War, Spiderman 2 is on track of outselling GoW:R.

And your ranking there is in pretty strong conflict with both what is popular and what is actually good. The Metal Gear games were good, but as stealth games they were always lacking compared to both Splinter Cell and especially Thief. FromSoft are a one Trick Pony. R* North and Nintendo EAD are solid however.

And in no way is ND anywhere near the same level, or even above the likes of Valve. Valve releases have been industry defining. They are up there with Nintendo EAD and R*. Imagine not putting Valve as an S tier dev. Releasing a industry defining title 10 years ago doesnt mean they are relevant today. Especially when Valve release industry defining title after industry defining title.

ND is complete trash now.

1. Santa Monica
2. Guerilla Games
3. Polyphony Digital
4. Sucker Punch

That is all that Sony has left that is worth anything.

Phony is doomed... Doooomed I tellz ya. lol :P

@kvallyx: I would argue Insomniac are good too. Ratchet, Spiderman 2 and soon Wolverine is pretty decent output for what will be a 4 year old console by t he time wolverine releases.

But yes, Naughty Dog has suffered the same fate as BioWare. They lost all their talent, and what we have now is a zombie.

They are good, but I believe their best work was with the Resistance games. Unfortunately they got buried in a sea of shooters during that time and didn't get the love they deserved. R&C RA was ok. Spider-Man 1 and Miles were really good. Spider-Man 2 was a step in the wrong direction. But we have had like 30 Spider-Man games over the years, so it's nothing new or exciting.

Hopefully Wolverine gets them back on track.

5 million sales in 11 days. Soo sad, the lemmings are lining up to jump off the cliff as I type.

That's more than Super Mario Wonder, which is impressive

But I would think Wonder will still sell more overall, Mario Games have Legs

Selling faster than tears of the kingdom.

4.5 million returned for refund 8 hours later. lol :P

Did Spider-Man just outsell Mario? I didn't see that coming.

@Maroxad: The Last of Us is far superior to anything Valve has ever made.

Valve literally hasn't made a good game in 13 years.

ND made the most awarded video game in history just 3 years ago (TLOU2)

Then they made the most GOTY winning game of 2016 (UC4) and before that The Last of Us, the consensus greatest game of all time.

In the same ten year span Valve hasn't made shit.

Bioware and Valve used to be S-tier. They've now both dropped to A-tier.

Naughty Dog cemented themselves as an S-tier dev in 2013 (taking Bioware's spot)

From Software cemented themselves as an S-tier in 2022 with Elden Ring (taking Valve's spot)

There can only be five S-tier developers at once.

@kvallyx: And in 2 years time ND will release TLOU3 and it will be universally praised as one of the finest video games ever made, consistently being compared to Shawshank Redemption.

Shawshank Redemption>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>TLOU series

LOL

The only flop Valve made is Artifact. Counter Strike 2 might have been a disappointment to some. But despite that it is still incredibly popular and active with over 1 million playing as we speak. Journalist awards mean very little. These are the same kind of people who wonder why Marvel movies dont win the Oscars. The last relevant game Naughty Dog made was TLOU1 and that was 10 years ago. The rest generate a lot of initial hype, but quickly fall into obscurity.

If we limit S tier devs to 5 I would put

Valve, Nintendo EAD, R* North, SuperCell Games, Riot Games

These 5 devs are arguably the most noteworthy/prominent devs in gaming right now. Say what you will about Supercell, I think they suck. But they arguably played the single biggest hand in shaping the mobile gaming market, and has dominated the scene for a decade.

Imagine being a self proclaimed Hermit King and then say ridicilous statements like "Valve literally hasn't made a good game in 13 years"

TLOU series >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> all Xbox content

@Maroxad: RIot Games??? what a joke lmao they are D-tier. SuperCell is E-Tier or F-Tier.

You keep ignoring TLOU2, as if it wasn't the most awarded game of all time. TLOU2 is the LOTR: Return of the King of video games.

And excuse me for pointing out facts. Valve hasn't delivered nothing but garbage since Portal 2.

HL:Alyx - shitty VR game no one cares about

CS2- trash multiplayer game

CSGO - trash multiplayer game.

Why bring popularity? We're talking quality, not sales.

The top 5, S-tier developers in terms of producing quality games are:

1. Naughty Dog
2. Rockstar North
3. Kojima Productions
4. From Software
5. Nintendo EAD

Every game released by them is almost guaranteed to be GOTY and will contend for 'Game of the Generation'.

Insomniac is Sony’s best studio right now. Naughty Dog is overrated especially The Last of Us franchise.

Life of Black Tiger >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> all of Sony

True

Are you seriously downplaying how significant both Supercell and Riot are? I don't like their games either. But to ignore how significant they are in the gaming landscape is absurd. If Naughty Dog would go under, gaming move on just fine. But if SuperCell or Riot went under, they would leave a MASSIVE void. When Riot Games announces a game, the industry takes notice.

And Kojima Productions havent been relevant since MGS3. MGS4 was trash, MGS5 was met with fairly mediocre reception down the line. And Death Stranding was cool, but overshadowed by other games released in the same time period.

From Soft made it big with Dark Souls and Elden Ring. And as bad as Elden Ring was, I do acknowledge its relevance. But Dark Souls 2 and 3 just came and went, same with Sekiro.

Half Life Alyx is the most popular VR game.

CS2: is probably the most active FPS. With over a million concurrent players.

DOTA 2: While not as popular as League of Legends still has a massive following. Its map editor has also spawned a new genre. With DOTA Autochess. It is also crucial to gaming culture.

Compare this to TLOU2, which unlike TLOU1 failed to leave gamers with a lasting impression (at least a positive one).

Edit: You seem to have a lot of confidence in a dev who can't even ship out the promised multiplayer mode 3 years AFTER release. Looking at the responses from everyone else in this thread, I think you are alone in having that confidence.

5 million bought for a buggy 4 hour campaign?? The numbers don't add up.

@Maroxad:

The only bad thing about tlou2 was no factions and some of the plot/story was bad/trashy. Rest of the game was another master piece.

Mechanicswise it was good. Great even. But that doesnt change the fact that the game didnt hold up compared to the original. And was pretty forgettable compared to games like Doom Eternal, Half Life Alyx, Genshin Impact, Animal Crossing New Horizons or even Ghosts of Tsushima.

But the game's qualities did not make up for the game essentially breaking Naughty Dog. All we have gotten from Naughty Dog since that game is delays and a really bad port/remake of TLOU1.

@Maroxad:

They were idiots, they got too technical. Wanted to make a splash with the story/plot twist forgetting it's a video game not some kind of life changing experience as a result they turned it into poop for a story. Also removing factions and trying to turn it into a live service crap was another mistake. They could have had it as a add on to tlou 2 for like 10 to 20$ extra and be done with it. We probably would have another NG game by now if it wasn't for that.

🤔

@SolidGame_basic: imagine being so starved for video games, that 5 million cows went out and picked this up in less than 10 days. Its pretty sad when you think about it.

@Maroxad: valve barely releases games, maybe once every 10 years. They're only able to get away with it because of milking the monopoly that is steam. If they were forced to develop games as their main revenue source, they would devolve into S - rank, ie shit rank.

The Lab, Artifact, DOTA Underlords, Aperature Hand Lab, Half Life Alyx, Aperature Desk Job, CounterStrike 2.

Of these only Artifact was a flop, and CS2 seems to be a disappointment with the community. Overall, 1-2 misses against 5-6 hits.

If I tiered devs based on my personal preferences

Top Tier: Intelligent Systems, Ludeon, Nintendo EAD, Valve, Paradox Interactive

As for Sony devs,

Interesting: Housemarque, Insomniac, Bungie

Maybe: Sucker Punch

Irrelevant: Santa Monica, Naughty Dog, Guerilla Games, Polyphony Digital (why play Gran Turismo when Forza Exists?)

Damn,nearly 42 million not arsed about SPIDE8MAN 2.

Fear not Sony,xbox studios COD,minecraft and third party got you covered 👍

@Maroxad: Multiplayer games and their popularity... yawn at trash people with trash opinions. Do you think Marvel movies are the best movies in the world? Same energy. LoL and Overwatch are two shitty Marvel movies. TLOU Part I is The Godfather Part I and TLOU2 is the Godfather Part II.

I'm downplaying them because they only make shit games that only a peahead would enjoy. Unfortunately there are way more peaheads than 1%ers.

TLOU2 was recently voted #19 best game of all time by the entire gaming industry (the same list TLOU got #2 on btw), its also the most awarded game in history and has won more awards than every single Valve game combined.

MGS5 wasn't considered mediocre. it was an absolute masterpiece. One of the few games (at the time, now its way more common) to score a perfect 10/10 on both IGN and GS... One of the last games to do that before it was... MGS4.

MGS5 was the highest rated game of 2015 on metacritic. It outscored both The Witcher 3 and Bloodborne, two of the best games of the decade.

What is wrong, are you afraid of a thinking opponent? Actually being challenged in a video game? Multiplayer games offer far more depth than their SP counterparts. For someone using Marvel movies, as an argument against me, you seem to be lacking in self awareness. Mr. I-cite-journalist-awards (the same journalists who are asking why Marvel isnt winning the oscars).

You are putting a lot of your opinion on journalists.

But sure, go and tell me why MGS5, a game where you spend roughly half your playtime running to objectives, with stealth sections inferior to what Thief had 2 decades ago, is somehow a masterpiece. Combine this with a lack of boss fights and a barely existant story.

And cut the cliches and platitudes "Godfather of gaming"... they don't impress me. The Last of Us is a poor man's The Road. Silent Hill 2, Mother 3, Gabriel Knight, Planescape Torment and Disco Elysium all had superior storytelling. On a per hour basis, Portal had stronger writing too.

But in the end, none of this matters because while Insomniac have been putting out 2-3 hits since the PS5. Naughty Dog have only botched a remake and constantly delayed its other projects. The PS5 is 3 years old now, and Naughty Dog have been doing nothing.

Until Naughty Dog actually puts up, Insomniac remains the star of the PS5 show. Yeah they made a great game 10 years ago, then they made a good game 3 years ago. But making that good game broke the studio and the people who made that great game 10 years ago have all left.

@Mozelleple112:

I'm a big MGS fan and MGS 5 was not a 10/10 mostly because the story wasn't as good as prior MGS games and the repetitiveness of some of the missions. They could have gotten more creative. MGS ground zeroes was a perfect piece, unfortunately the rest of the game wasn't as fluid.

Tlou was a great game that was new story wise and fun gameplay wise and also came with a really fun mp that for me was better than Uncharted. Tlou2 had no factions, but better gameplay and a worse story than the original. 2 little mishaps is what separated tlou2 and tlou.

Wowza!

@SolidGame_basic: this is because they bundled spiderman 2 with the ps5. If not for that, it would probably get half the sales. No returns either, final sale.

@blaznwiipspman1:

Aren't other games like Mario and mw2 bundled with consoles?!??. I know not all are but mw3 is already bundled with Xbox and PS5 for example.

There is an Xbox bundle with MW3? Can you share a link to this bundle?

@Pedro:

There is literally a thread in system wars that has black Friday deals and I think there are a couple mW3 bundles. It's not surprising cod games are always bundled.

just checked GS and the game is still an

#HaH@salessaps

What are you talking about? r&c just ok? scoring 9 every where and winning graphics king for that year with digital foundry. then spiderman 2 being better than the first spiderman and miles.

everyone is praising spiderman 2. no has said once they went in the wrong direction.

30 spiderman games over the years. when over 15 years ago?

Yeah, R&C was decent, but nothing great nor memorable. Spider-Man 2 was much worse than Spider-Man 1 and Miles Morales IMO.

Nobody is talking about Spider-Man 2 anymore. A lot of people have said they went in the wrong direction.

Yeah, 30 Spider-Man games over the years, including on Xbox.

I think you meant no one is talking about Starfield or Redfall anymore 😄 Spider-Man 2 was just nominated for GOTY at The Game Awards 😎

I have not seen any MW3 bundle for Xbox. That is why I am asking you to share the link to this bundle.

Are you talking about Back Friday Xbox Series X bundle at Walmart? Link: Xbox Series X Diablo 4 Bundle with Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 3 - Microsoft Xbox Series X despite it also comes with Diablo 4, this is as close as I can find MW3/Xbox Series X Bundle. That's a Hell of a deal if you ask me.

@davillain: I have seen the Diablo IV bundle. Interesting that they are adding MW3 to that bundle.

No, that isn't what I meant. The sad state of affairs right now is that Spider-Man 2, which flopped, is not being talked about by gamers any longer. They played, and 7 hours later they went back to good games like Starfield, which won GOTY.

I feel bad for this game falling off the face of the earth, so I had to bump this thread to see if it can garner any more excitement. I hate seeing games die off so fast :(

SONY is on a ROLL guys!

Rolling off the front page that is. :(