What would your solution be for the Disinformation Crisis?

Nah, I would argue they have mostly been kicked to the fringes. Anti-GMO, anti-nuclear and anti-western medicine used to be a lot more common on the left than they are today. Tankies too are being faced with stiff scrutiny. They still exist, but they don't really exist in the mainstream. I don't think Bernie Sanders could attempt his anti-GMO stance again. Granted, my anecdotes could be biased, since I am now a parto f the vegan community who are heavily pro-GMO for obvious reasons.

That said, I do agree with you that this isnt a left-right issue. It is a issue of lunatics vs everyone else.

Yeah, for sure, we don't really create idpol threads, it just isnt a very interesting topic, and wont solve issues the world is actually facing. But some posters insist on bringing it to random discussions, including this one. When I create threads, they usually follow a theme of efficiency/environmentalism/health and other topics focused on sustainability. Society has been good to me, so I want my children and possible future grandchildren to enjoy the luxuries I have had.

If I wanted to discuss transgender issues. I would have made a thread surrounding one of the 172 anti-trans rights bills from this year in 2023 alone (and that is just in the US).

@Maroxad:

1. It's extremely relevant especiaplly when you mentioned " critical thinking skills" in which you have proven you have none. This is not " Culture wars crap" . If you ever have children you realize it is a relevant issue that could effect our society. Again I will ask you to think about the question because in the end " that's what matters". This wasn't being talked about I'n elementary schools according to you and many leftist ( you were wrong). You fell for misinformation.( this is also part of the topic). Gender reaffirming care for children was a conspiracy theory until it wasn't ( again more misinformation.) Again you obsessed over the wrong issue. You are the definition of tribalistic.

2. Know I'm just taking what I hear often from main stream entertainment media. You would be better off arguing that they are fringe leftist.

3. Ohh please. Influential because she is a hysterical fool they have propped up. That is the entire point! Have you ever heard her answer a question without a script? It's embarrassingly bad. Also again I'll ask you to use critical thinking skills before you make such a low IQ comment. 21% of gen Z identities as LGBTQ+. The younger generation is obsessed with sexual identify because leftist nutjobs force them to be. Man made climate change is not an actual issue that is anywhere near as important as the left makes it out to be and their alternatives have often made the problem " WORSE"

1. You don't either and your just reading shit from left wing Op Ed's. China grew mostly in the past few years by buying up Africa and putting them in endless debt.

2. If your stupid enough to think it was just a coincidence he did it when Biden was in office I don't know what to tell you. Even many of the leftist in the US acknowledge it wouldn't happen under Trump. Mainly because his ego wouldn't allow it.

3. That's all we have. He wasn't president. The fact is he had more foreign blunders in two years then Trump had in four

4. They were. They certainly weren't sending warships. The media would gladly report it as they loved to make Trump look bad. The thing os nothing so brazen ever happened.

LSJ posted an opinion, which isn't refitting anything. For someone who talks about " literacy " perhaps learn the definition of the word " refute".

Again for someone who mentions " critical thinking skills" you need to learn some.

Trump would have handed Ukraine on a silver platter to Putin if he could.

That 's an assumption that has no factual evidence behind it.

........................................................lol. It's the most logical conclusion based on what we know about Trump.

It appears your falling for more misinformation.

No I did not. I read your link which, once again, said the opposite of your assertion

1. Yes it is culture wars crap. And Gender Affairming care for children isn't what you think it is, what you assume Gender Affairming care is, would actually go against WPATH standards. Anyways, now that we got this culture wars crap out of the way. We can drop this low IQ culture wars stuff already. It is tiresome, and some of us prefer to focus on real issues. Like Anti-intellectualism, Climate Change, Democratic Erosion.

2. Your points would be wrong then. What is actually being said in left wing circles is that we should deal with the obesity epidemic in a productive and healthy way. Fat shaming is not that. Again, you can read through the democratic party platforms, countering the obesity epidemic was a common theme. Which goes against the narrative you were peddling. Amazing what a little fact checking can do.

3. If you actually paid attention to left wing circles, you will see that LGBTQ+ issues are barely brought up. Unless you explicitly follow LGBTQ+ activists and other culture warriors, you will see that the left generally deal with more pressing topics. But again, you would know this if you actually sought out leftists irl. And not just engaged with a few terminally online fools who don't represent anything of note. And no, the damage done by climate change is an existential crisis facing humanity.

You clearly don't even know what an Op Ed is, considering how often you incorrectly use that term. Stop copying arguments from other people without undersatnding why we even use them in the first place. It is OVERWHELMINGLY accepted that by leaving the TPP, the US gave the chinese an opportunity to create its own china centered trade pact known as the RCEP, which massively enriched the country. Leaving the TPP was a strategic failure of an unprecedented scale. I say that as someone who formerly opposed the TPP, only to realize how stupid I was for opposing it (so I changed my position, to adapt to what should have been obvious). And your argument of Putin not having invaded shows a massive level of geopolitical ignorance. What lead to Putin invading Ukraine was an assumption that NATO would not interfere. Which came from a mixture of yesmen and possibly anti-cancer drugs. This may surprise you, but there are more actors in the world, than just the US, Russia and China. And when combined, the EU makes for an incredibly impressive military. But again, you would know this if you had even a most rudimentary understanding of geopolitics. In fact, I can point to SEVERAL decisions from Trump that directly resulted in this war being as bad as it did.

• Withholding 400 million dollar military aid from Ukraine in 2019
• Repeatedly undermining Ukraine's security and sovereignity even prior to being elected. Going as far as to argue that the US should Recognize Crimea as Russian.
• Extorted Ukraine in regards to Hunter Biden's Laptop
• Threatening fellow NATO countries.
• Weakened and Undermined NATO at every opportunity
• Considered Leaving NATO

Every single of these thigns Trump did, resulted in the War in Ukraine being as bad as it did. Trump would not stop the war in Ukraine, if anything, he would have made it worse. But then again, this is coming from a fact based position, not one based on empty promises from a con artist who failed to meet over half of his campaign promises.

Will you ever pivot to something concrete to demonstrate your case, or is feelings all you got? This is exactly what I mean about your critical thinking skills being sorely lacking. Literally everything you say is purely backed up by feelings, rather than things you can actually demonstrate.

@silentchief said:

@Maroxad said:

@silentchief said:

Knowing what actually effects policy change may help your argument unfortunately you are absolutely oblivious to it. The lefts quest to make gender completely seperate from Sex is how they justify young children going thorough changes that will effect them both biologically and socially. For someone who champions critical thinking skills you have none.

No they don't. " Big is beautiful " isn't a term used on the fringes. Glorifying plus sized super stars as " bold and sexy" is a leftist trope.

Did Greta Thunberg get on " Time" magazine on her own? Was she named person of the year on her own? Denying the fact the left has propped her upped and shilled for her is something anyone with a most basic level of awareness should acknowledge.

1. Why do you always double down when wrong? Gender is seperate from Sex, and has been for decades now. There is a reason Biology textbooks, always used the word sex, rather than gender. Some textbooks, (and more common in modern ones) even explicitly highlight the difference between the two.

This is from Genetics: A Conceptual Approach by Benjamin A. Pierce (1993).

2. Yes, it a term used by the fringes. I get that you need to cherrypick and strawman to make the left look bad. But it is clear you don't havea good grasp on the left. Which is why you couldnt even tell the difference between a leftist and a liberal.

3. The time magazine picks people based on influence, and as far as by the time she got into TIME magazine goes, she had already completely changed discourse on climate change. She was the most influential person of that year so she was aptly put in there. Get over it.

As for Biden, people didn't lose faith in the US defending them because Biden was weak. It was the results of sentiments that grew under Trump. The US is far too politically unstable, and we can not rely on the US, because it is very possible that the US might get another dysfunctional isolationist. Who wants to withdraw out of NATO.

And for the record, while Biden is getting some blame for afghanistan, most experts are putting most of the blame on Trump. Biden carried through the disaster, but it was Trump who set the disasterous conditions up. Which shouldn't be surprising since Trump was completely incompetent at geopolitics.

Hell, your own quote said as much "Majorities in key member states now think the US political system is broken, that China will be more powerful than the US within a decade"

US Political System being broken has been a sentiment since Trump has gotten into power. We saw how Trump lost the popular vote, but won the presidency anyway due to the electoral college, we saw how Trump completely botched the US's geopolitical standing and handed it to China on a silver platter. We saw how Trump set up the terms (against virtually every military expert) to allow the taliban to take over the country. Biden is not responsible for these (he only carried through what Trump had already set up). The US had a 70 year old with the temprament and political skill of a toddler in charge, and allowed such a person to get in to begin with, that is what leads to the above sentiment, not Joe Biden. Who is actually well liked.

While the US is not a stable ally, as Trump clearly demonstrated. But for now, they have a level headed person in charge.

1. What are you not understanding here? Let me ask you a simple question. Should a minor be able to seek gender affirming care? This means hormones, surgery, etc... why is this so hard for you to see the connection between the two? You are programed at this point. And it's based off studies from a complete whackjob. If they are seperate then why does one feel the need to get hormones and surgery to match the sex? They are intrinsically linked. One doesn't exist without the other.

2. Well I guess entertainment media is made up of mostly the fringes.

3. Influential to who? Fringe activist and shill media? Again she is a whack job and the support for her wasn't from fringe activist it was from the main stream left.

As for Biden you are delusional. The withdrawal would have never been botched like that under Trump. Say whatever you want Biden has been a door mat for every country including China. China is better off now then they were under Trump. Europe disliked Trump because he was tired of defending your pathetically weak continent who has done nothing but rely on us. He wanted you to deal with your own problems and he is absolutely correct. Biden on the other hand is just a bumbling moron and has had more foreign policy disasters in two years then Trump had in four.

Trump said if he was president during the withdrawal and they did what they did we would have never left. What did Biden do? Let Americans die and gave them billions of dollars in millitary equipment.

Russia invades Ukraine shortly after he takes office ( gee I wonder why)

Iran threatens us with warships. ( you honestly see that happening under Trump?

Meanwhile he shows his incompetence and shows our millitary is now an embarrassment. They thought Russia would take Ukraine in 3 weeks 🤣🤣

I agree silent 👍

If the MIC paid him more than Putin then it could swing the other way. But he admired Putin.

We have Trump's political history

• Withholding 400 million dollar military aid from Ukraine in 2019
• Repeatedly undermining Ukraine's security and sovereignity even prior to being elected. Going as far as to argue that the US should Recognize Crimea as Russian.
• Extorted Ukraine in regards to Hunter Biden's Laptop
• Threatening fellow NATO countries.
• Weakened and Undermined NATO at every opportunity
• Considered Leaving NATO

Definately sounds like the kind of guy who would keep Russia out of Ukraine /s

Especially since what Russian Intelligence were trying to figure out primarily were the following

1. Will NATO get involved?
2. Will the EU get involved?
3. What level of support does Zelensky have?
4. What level of support does stronger ties to the EU have?
5. What level of support do stronger ties to us have?
6. What political ties with various groups can be used?

Why do you think Russia is primarily threatening economic, rather than military consequences? They know they can't take out the EU, never could. But what they can do is reduce political will to defend Ukraine. That is and always was their goal, to reduce political will and foreign support for Ukraine.

Besides, it really wouldn't matter what US president would be in charge. For reasons that should be obvious to anyone with a basic understanding of how the separation of powers work.

Loud boos and yelling erupt when President Biden says Republicans are threatening to cut Social Security and Medicare. Rep. Marjorie Taylor Greene shouts liar at him. #NexstarDCpic.twitter.com/t4NpCOYcza

— Hannah Brandt (@HannahBrandt_TV) February 8, 2023

Like MTG here in this video. The response most likely is calling you a liar.

@sargentd: For your sake I hope you leave the conspiracy theories behind.

What's a conspiracy. Elaborate.

@sargentd Regarding Ukraine: It is well known it happened. He even got impeached for it. Just because he wasnt removed doesnt change the fact that he did it. As for Crimea Still internationally recognized by the international community as a part of Ukraine. Should Finland return to Russia as well? And what he did undermined the sovereignity of a foreign nation. Which helped embolden Russia.

Regarding NATO: Yeah, he threatened them to pay more. Whether you think he was justified or not, it doesnt change the fact that what he said bolstered Russia. And weakened the alliance.

Hate to break it out to ya, but words, especially in a position of power, have consequences. And Trump did a lot to embolden dictatorships all while getting taken advantage of every single one of them. Why do you think we were so critical of his ****hole country comments?

1. This is what happens when you surround yourself in a bubble. Gender affirming care is exactly what I think it is. This is what you always do. Deny something is happening until you eventually end up defending it. I'd rather you educate yourself on what the battle is actually about. Let me Inform you..

Doctors are now considering allowing children to undergo hormone therapy at earlier ages in order to change their bodies. Under current guidelines, that type of treatment is reserved for children 16 and older. However, authors of the new guidelines are considering striking that age requirement so children could begin hormone therapy earlier.

Again if you ever decide to have children instead of cats this will be a more important issue for you. Far more pressing then climate hysteria.

2. What is being said in " left wing circles " doesn't prove what I'm saying to be incorrect. I'm glad your aware that the " healthy at any size movement " is bullshit. What I don't understand is your failure to acknowledge that the movement has moved beyond the fringes.

3. Stop using the term " left wing circles " this is vague bullshit with no credibility. There are tons of different political social groups that focus on different topics. Your leftwing circles do not necessarily represent the greater society. The LGBTQ+ psychos are somehow the most vocal and have the most power. If they didn't have the power the President of the United States wouldn't be pandering to them with batshit insane policy. You then mention climate hysteria on the left as an issue only to then defend climate hysteria.

I know exactly what an Op-Ed piece is. It's an Opinion article. You are talking about using other people's arguments when you haven't come up with a single argument of your own. I have heard what you have said dozens of times because I have read those theories in " Op-Ed's. If you had an original argument that would be one thing but you would need to be knowledgeable enough about the situation to even have that. The problem is you're not so regurgitate the same arguments from leftwing think tanks and take it as fact.

The goal of leaving the TPP was to create something better which never occurred. Being involved in any trade deal with China is a losing battle for the US because they don't obide by the rules, restricting US goods while engaging in patent theft and selling knock offs of foreign made products to no benefit of our own. The problem is nobody has the balls to restrict China from any trade deals because massive multi billion dollar corporations use them for cheap labor. You are somehow ok with obiding by the status quo where China bends everyone over the table.

You talk about geopolitical ignorance and then talk about Nato's impressive millitary? Nato's millitary is a joke without the US it has no backbone. The Russian invasion of Ukraine proved this and highlighted the fact Trump was correct. Europe needs to build up it's millitary. That was Trump's entire criticism of Nato and as soon as he left office it was proven correct.

The mental gymnastics you use to somehow put the Russian invasion of Ukraine on Trump is mind boggling. Again I'm not sure how you tried to promote " critical thinking " and this is the logic you came up with.

The entire point of Trump threatening to leave Nato was to motivate them to become self sufficient.

You are taking assumptions and calling them facts and your reasoning here is embarrassingly bad. Extorted Ukraine in regards to Hunter Biden's Laptop? Are you serious now? The current president gave the country money because they hired his crack head son. I honestly can't even take you seriously at this point. The fact is if Trump were president the war wouldn't be happening now. Again Biden has had more foreign blunders in two years then Trump had in four. That is a fact. Your mental gymnastics In somehow blaming all those blunders on Trump is nothing more then an emotional response.

It does actually. It's a perfect opportunity to show how weak and worthless they are( NATO). He would get Putin out of Ukraine and gloat about it and if he stopped it from happening in the first place it wouldn't matter because the leftist such as yourself would have said " it would have never happened ".

1. The only thing that needs to be pointed out is that your article is nearly 6 years old. And it concerned stuff that were being considered 6 years ago. The rest is completely off-topic and I see no reason to respond to it.

2. Nothing to back up your claim. Meanwhile pretty much every left wing political platform found in both US and elsewhere has explicit policies designed to counter obesity. If the healthy at any size had taken grasp in the mainstream, we wouldnt be seeing these policies.

3. While you are correct that the left wing isn't a monolith, you are woefully incorrect on the rest. Try going outside. Being terminally online is not good for your judgement. If you look at legislation pushed by left wing parties. Pink politics have little traction and influence in the left. In the US, democratic platforms primarily focus on infrastructure, sustainability, economic opportunities for the impoverished. And in the EU, I don't think there is a single pink party who holds any seats in any parliament (only finding some minor success in local politics).

That is not quite what an Op-Ed is. There are opinion pieces that are not Op-Eds for instance.

Regarding NATO without the US. NATO without the US would still be the second most impressive fighting force in the world only behind the United States. Not exaclty a joke. Trump not having stopped Putin's invasion decision is overwhelingly supported by evidence, meanwhile you still have nothing to offer but conjectures and feelz to argue for the opposite.

And the rest of your tinfoilhattery is just absurd. The fact that you, are calling anyone out for critical thinking, while offering nothing but conjecture is absolutely hilarious but not out of character. Why do you think SUD called you unreasonable earlier in this thread? You have been spending the past few pages arguing against evidence, facts and a basic understanding of geopolitics with nothing but conjecture on your part, while citing sources that refute your own point?

You have completely failed to make your case, but you really strengthened the initial point of this thread that something needs to be done regarding media literacy, scientific literacy and critical thinking, by being a shining example of what happens when these are neglected. Your own inability to understand the few sources you did cite, shows why media literacy is needed.

What you call information is reasonable prediction based on past behavior.

guys.

i did some fact based digging and came to a shocking conclusion.

china released the wuhan virus on the world in 2019 because they knew trump was weak!

game

set

match

1. It is now getting traction again because we have a President that fully supports this. Did you honestly think they were going to just give up and go home? 🤣 If it isn't an issue why does the main stream left constantly support it? States are now trying to ban it because a whackjob president wants to support it at the federal level.

2. So tell the fringes to stop glorifying it.

3. Lol I go outside often. I have to interact with people on a regular basis. Take a look at the younger generation and it may cause a little more concern for you. Regardless it's not like you can't see the massive pandering the left does for LGBTQ and their failure to improve the things that they supposedly support. They support the impoverished by passing the blame on to others and forcing them to believe without the help of the government they have no possible chance of success. In doing so they divide the nation in every election cycle. That is really what the leftist are good at In the US. Making all their supporters feel like victims.

Listen to what you just said right there. Nato is comprised of 30 countries. 29 of them combined are still significantly weaker then the US. The combined might of Russia and China would crush Nato without the US and that in itself is a problem.

You talking about critical thinking and literacy is amazing when you have provided zero evidence. Presumption and predictions are not evidence. This is coming from the same guy who said an Assault weapon was clearly defined yet then failed to define the term 🤣.

Even I know my predictions on Trump and Russia are not facts they are presumptions. But you take your theory and pass it off as fact. It's mind boggling how narcissistic and uneducated you are at the same time.

Regardless the only point in arguing with someone is to help them gather a new perspective and you are so far gone into leftwing rhetoric that it is an absolute waste of time.

How many countries were invaded under Trump?

I'm quite sure you think this question is some magnificant "gotcha", but question is too vague and it's relevance is not obvious, as it has nothing to do with assessing Trump's past behavior concerning his very odd admiration of Putin and Russia.

What's odd is the presumption that the failures of are current administration were somehow caused by the previous president. Regardless say what you want but Trump admired no one more then himself. He had pride in the US and it's millitary might so much that no dictators crossed him. Our president now is nothing more then a door mat. I'm less concerned about presumptuous accusations of what would happen and more interested into what actually happened.

Bullshit. He called KIAs suckers and losers. Said he was smarter than the generals. Said he liked people who weren't POWs.

The KIA quote was from an " Anonymous source ". It was never verified. Again stop falling for misinformation. The POW quote was a dig specifically at John McCain. As for are generals I'm not sure. The current ones we have are unfortunately severely inept.

1. Why do you keep bringing up a topic that has nothing to do with this thread? If you want to derail topics over your LGBT topics, why don't you just create your own thread rather than trying to derail topics that discuss a real issue rather than your fake culture war crap? Enough is enough. Nobody cares.

2. We do call them out when they do it. However, they are just that, fringes, we don't encounter them often.

3. The only concerns for the younger generation I do have is that they are gonna grow up in a climate catastrophe and witness a biodiversity collapse, as well as various pandemics that will make COVID look like the common cold. You are concerned for the completely wrong reasons.

Yeah, 29 small countries, including some very small ones. 2 even have a population smaller than a million. And I wouldnt be so sure of that. Russia's military was massively overhyped. And China prefers soft power over hard power. A war with Europe would be incredibly impractical for a myriad of a reasons. Even invading Taiwan is highly unlikely. As we have seen with Ukraine, China's ties with Russia are even weaker than previously thought. And that is just with one nation. What would make China want to go to war with an entire continent for Russia if it isn't even interested in aiding it for one country? Especially since this would put a wrench in their soft power plans.

Then there are other issues

1. As the invasion of ukraine has demonstrated, military spending does not necessarily equate to military might.
2. China's military is incredibly inexperienced.
3. China is currently dealing with immense internal strife.
4. A war with europe would be a complete logistical nightmare for China.

I wasn't asking you to back your stuff up with sources necessarily, I was asking you to back them up with further elaboration, which you have completely failed to provide. Meanwhile, everyone else itt, have provided plenty of elaboration why the invasion of Ukraine would still likely have happened under Trump. Others did provide evidence, so I saw little reason to do the same. As sources had already been provided by others.

The notion that Putin invaded because Trump was no longer in charge is a very america-centric worldview, that fails to account for Trump's history as commander in chief (spoilers: He was very incompetent), how the separation of power works, or even the fact that the EU has a military might that dwarfs russia several times over.

Four sources for the KIA comment. Doesn't matter if it was McCain specific. That same principle applies to his opinion on POWs. This from a coward with suspicious bone spurs to avoid serving. You do know the Generals aren't brand new to service?

@Maroxad:

1. Why do you keep bringing up a topic that has nothing to do with this thread? If you want to derail topics over your LGBT topics, why don't you just create your own thread rather than trying to derail topics that discuss a real issue rather than your fake culture war crap? Enough is enough. Nobody cares.

2. We do call them out when they do it. However, they are just that, fringes, we don't encounter them often.

3. The only concerns for the younger generation I do have is that they are gonna grow up in a climate catastrophe and witness a biodiversity collapse, as well as various pandemics that will make COVID look like the common cold. You are concerned for the completely wrong reasons.

Yeah, 29 small countries, including some very small ones. 2 even have a population smaller than a million. And I wouldnt be so sure of that. Russia's military was massively overhyped. And China prefers soft power over hard power. A war with Europe would be incredibly impractical for a myriad of a reasons. Even invading Taiwan is highly unlikely. As we have seen with Ukraine, China's ties with Russia are even weaker than previously thought. And that is just with one nation. What would make China want to go to war with an entire continent for Russia if it isn't even interested in aiding it for one country? Especially since this would put a wrench in their soft power plans.

Then there are other issues

1. As the invasion of ukraine has demonstrated, military spending does not necessarily equate to military might.
2. China's military is incredibly inexperienced.
3. China is currently dealing with immense internal strife.
4. A war with europe would be a complete logistical nightmare for China.

I wasn't asking you to back your stuff up with sources necessarily, I was asking you to back them up with further elaboration, which you have completely failed to provide. Meanwhile, everyone else itt, have provided plenty of elaboration why the invasion of Ukraine would still likely have happened under Trump.

1. It has everything to do with the thread . It's about misinformation and critical thinking. The left has used lots of misinformation on this very topic and you have failed to use any critical thinking to acknowledge this. You won't talk about it because it makes the left look horrible so you will pass it off as a non issue.

2. We do in the US especially in the the media. Perhaps this is a cultural difference that isn't seen as often where you are from. Or perhaps it is glorified in our media because Americans are fat and they pander to their audience.

3. That sounds like Climate hysteria. It won't matter if the vast majority of people in the civilized world embrace Marxist group think and deny reality. The world won't be worth living in anyway.

Yes Russias military was overhyped which shows how inadequate are threat assessment was. However they are a nuclear power and they have a fair amount of well trained soldiers. NATO should be powerful enough to effortlessly deal with them. With China the issue is manpower and money. They have lots of both. The enemy of my enemy is my friend. I hope that's not a mentality they adopt in the future.

I did. Nobody here provided anything other then rhetoric I have heard over and over again from leftwing news sources. When elaborating it would be nice to see an opinion that didn't look like it came from " The Atlantic ". The " Trump was Putins puppet " argument is nonsense. If Putin didn't respect him why not do it when Trump was in office? He had 4 years so why do it as soon as Biden got into office? To think Trump would have gotten away with " handing them over on a silver platter " is absolute nonsense.

1. No it really doesn't. This thread has to do with ways we can counter the spread of disinformation, not parts of the academic consensus that we don't like. We don't want to discuss it because Culture Wars crap is boring. Go make a thread about it and stop derailing this thread. This is my last response to you on LGBTQ+ stuff in this thread. Enough is enough. You have already gotten several threads locked due to your derailing, I am not gonna let that happen here.

2. Again, even in the US, look at the democratic party platform. Here is from California. If they thought being obese was fine, this would not make it into the party platform of California.

Take a comprehensive approach to childhood obesity by providing adequate time for exercise, offering nutrition education in schools, and ensuring that school-based meals are healthy and appealing to students;

Support access to healthy eating in and out of school through nutrition and cooking classes that address the availability of food choices that do not increase the risk of diabetes and obesity;

https://cadem.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/03/CDP-Platform-2022-FINAL-.pdf

3. The Biodiversity collapse is happening right now. And we are already seeing a myriad of climate refugees. Which will lead to massive immigration waves to europe, because africa and the middle east become uninhabitable.

https://www.europarl.europa.eu/RegData/etudes/ATAG/2022/729334/EPRS_ATA(2022)729334_EN.pdf

https://www.unhcr.org/climate-change-and-disasters.html

China's biggest issue with a war with europe is a logistical one. As well as that of military inexperience. Both the EU invading China, or China invading the EU is extremely unlikely, due to that alone, and this is before you even consider nukes. France alone has around 300 nukes. China has at least 350 nukes. A war is extremely unlikely. Especially over a floundering ally.

Every source you provided refuted your own point. You did nothing but commit constant self ownage.

As for why he didnt invade earlier. We don't know and we have nowhere near enough evidence to support one conclusion or the other. And I don't like hypothesising about it. Just don't think your hypothesiis is well supported... at all.

@Maroxad:

Every source you provided refuted your own point. You did nothing but commit constant self ownage.

Please stop using words you don't know the meaning of. "Refute" means to disprove. Work on your reading comprehension and critical thinking skills and come up with an original argument as opposed to regurgitating the same shit you can find on any leftwing think piece.

As opposed to your regurgitating far right extremist pieces? Your own links always refute your posts.

Give me a single example.

I know exactly what refute means. That is why I used it.

But since you obviously need a reminder.

This was one of the many self owns you, SilentChief committed in this thread. After that MASSIVE blunder, you really are in no position to accuse anyone of having poor reading comprehension skills.

And while I am at it,

You: "If you ever have children you realize it is a relevant issue that could effect our society."

And shortly after: "Again if you ever decide to have children instead of cats this will be a more important issue for you. Far more pressing then climate hysteria."

Literally the post above your first accusation: "Society has been good to me, so I want my children and possible future grandchildren to enjoy the luxuries I have had."

Then you aalso accuse others of being tribalistic.

Meanwhile at least 3 posters here, including myself, pointed out that the divide was not between left or right when it came to disinformation, but rather lunatics vs normal people.

That was from one survey from 2020🤣. I specifically mentioned that recent recruits were more progressive. How does that discount the fact that all the past surveys leaned Republican? My point still stands the vast majority of millitary and ex millitary lean right. A single survey in 2020 doesn't refute that.

Again you're the same person who stormed out of a thread because you didn't know the difference between the word " various " and " all" then proceeded to call most semi automatic pistols " assault weapons 🤣. So yes I will continue to call you out on those epic fails.

In this thread you go on to contradicting one of your arguments. Conceding that climate hysteria was an issue on the left but then rigorously defending it every post after.

Failures of the current admin? This administration has created 12 million jobs and the economy has expanded. I honestly can't take talk of imagined failures seriously.

In a thread about misinformation you ironically keep spouting it. Bidens job claims are Mostly false.

On top of that people returning from the shitty jobs they left during Covid Isn't really much to brag about.

Nah. Gtfo with your red herrings. This is about it the FACT that 12 million NEW jobs have been created during the Biden admin. This has nothing to do the reason for them. There also not COVID jobs just coming back. You'll have to do better than that.

That survey from 2020 was the source you used. 38% isn't a vast majority. Let alone a majority. It might not even be a plurality.. Playing defensive doesnt help you save face. If you want to save face, own up that maybe you should have used a different survey/source.

I didn't storm out of any thread. I stopped posting because the debate got boring, Semantics debates are dull enough on their own, especially since it is obvious you are not arguing in good faith. While it can be difficult to find a universal definition since the term is unfortunately being muddied due to political interests. As far as Illinois and that thread was concerned, the definition of an assault weapon is clearly defined. You can look it up yourself. I wont mention the Illinois definition because if I did, this topic would go off rails again.

I could have worded my position better in that thread for sure, but poor wording doesnt change the fact that the anti-empiricism you are doing here is far worse.

Greta Thunberg isn't peddling "Climate Hysteria". She isn't making any 1999 predictions. Her concerns have been perfectly valid thus far. Acknowledging climate change as an existential threat, and the greatest we are facing is not "Climate Hysteria". In fact, there is a reason her reception among academics has been overwhelmingly positive (which cannot be said for every climate activist in the past).

Edit: And for the record, there is no such thing as Climate Hysteria, at least not something that is academically recognized. Overstating the numbers beyond what the scientific evidence says is not hysteria. Climate Hysteria is nothing more than loaded language in an attempt to downplay/discredit something that is overwhelmingly supported by scientific evidence. Nothing Greta Thunberg says falls out what the scientific papers or IPCC are saying (which is 1.5C)

Greta Thunberg has shown her true colors. She is a hard leftist against capitalism which climate change is all about.

ttps://unherd.com/thepost/greta-thunberg-throws-her-lot-in-with-the-anti-capitalist-left/

@JimB: Greta is a child running circles around all of your heroes without effort. But your tears are welcome.

Forums (sites, places) where disinformation is being spread willingly and widely should be held accountable.

The question of course remains: who is the one curating information?

I would say a forum of intellectuals and professors in the case material is the least worst option.

I think it worked for COVID at least. I mean have we even seen people going autistic or sick from the vaccines?

If there is so much fear and misinformation... trust the people that studied that kind of material? Seems like again, the best out of all the worst solutions.

@JimB: So... you don't like her political agenda. What does that have to do with the scientifically sound arguments she is making?

Good post. I just want to add that I think a lot of poeple don't understand what healthy skepticism is. Or even how academic expertise works.

• People say science is about skepticism, which is true, but there is also a great deal of trust. When you do research, you don't deny everything everyone else has already done. You often build on top of it. Otherwise, our understanding of physics would still be in the Newtonian era. However, if the data no logner holds up to new evidence, then older ideas are to be placed under scrutiny. Unfortunately this is not what we see online :( We often see skepticism and not stem from conflicting evidence, but a conflicting narrative.
• I also see a lot of misunderstanding how scientific expertise work. Just look at all those 1000s of scientists who reject climate change/accept creationism lists. When you go through the lists, you do find experts, but in every single case, these are experts in completely irrelevant fields. As an engineer, I am a layperson in Biology. This is why I keep pivoting to what Biologists within relevant fields say. Geneticists for genetics, neurology for neurologists, ect.

All in all, I am an engineer. It is extremely unlikely I know things in Biology that a biology freshman knows. Let alone an actual specialist in whatever relevant field I am discussing.

A big issue is the influencers, famous people who often give out false information or all too happy to share their false believes (Crypto is totally a safe investment guysssss!)

I dunno why we look up to Hollywood stars so much, they live in the stars while many of us live in the gutter. I guess it's human anyway, to keep wanting to progress and reach the high and mighty.

But yeah when people start believing falsehoods and start attacking experts (be it online or in person) we have a serious problem.

And I guess it's down to the governement to correct that problem.

When it comes to science:

Ok so my brother showed me a very interesting video about Atlantis and the Sahara desert the other day. The guy making the videos made some very good points. Both about Atlantis, and about how the sahara desert might have been covered by water some day in the past.

He made some solid points but right after I checked some sources and I've come to a different conclusion. I read up on the general consensus and I completely understand why scientist/Historians agree on certain things. What their reasoning is for doing so.

I'm also a firm believer of "the simplest explanation is often the right one" .

If vaccinations have proven effective against virusses in the past, then why would we suddenly have one that implants you with a chip and turns you into a retard... It makes no sense. I'm also pretty sure COVID is related to the SARS virus as we know it as SARS 2, so again makes sense that we would have vaccines rapidly to defend against it.

The smarter people are, the less likely they are to fall for foolishness like fake info. The more fearful people are (and a lot of leaders, countries, religions love keeping people scared (of the unknown, of foreigners, of 'the enemy')) the less intelligent the decisions they take will be.

Yeah, celebrity worship is not healthy. And also, LOL at Square Enix. If it werent for FF14 they would probably be in deep trouble now considering how bad the crypto market crashed.

Celebrity worship seems to mostly stem as a form of escapism. At least that is one way it can manifest. Escape from daily stress.

Mhm, we see this in gaming too. Remember the whole "Tiers are for [slurs]" fiasco in Super Smash Bros community? People who refused to accept that their characters with the knowledge we had, had less going for them than others. Metaknight, no matter what, was rife with bugs and other problems, that they had to ban him. Rather than even trying to prove the tier lists wrong, they used the phrase above. Of course, tier lists can be proven wrong, as we saw with Ice Climbers, Pikachu, Jigglypuff and as we have recently seen with Yoshi.

Mhm, I believe it is up to the government, more specifically the ministry of education. Finland, the nordics are pulling it off with some results.

Tier lists, much like our scientific/historical consensus, is based on our best understanding. While people are free to challenge it, they have to offer something better than just "Muh narrative" and semantics.

True and if people truly think they know better for their kin (no vaccines) they can just get their benefits of civilisation revoked for a while (like no restaurant or pub, no public transport, ...). You can't have your cake and eat it too.

We need to trust in systems that have kept our society upright for so long.

Since the greek we have been electing those we deem fit to be in parliament and speak in our behalve and do the things they think is right for us.

We need to trust in experts and educated people, as they have made the choices that have made humanity prosper for so long.

No, the plague didn't wipe us out. No, covid didn't wipe us out. I get that people are scared, and need something to hold on to, I don't get mass hysteria. When people were terrified and locked inside their house (that brief moment back before the government demanded it, people were just really scared to meet another human being) that is when I had some of the best walks around my neighbourhood. I could really absorb and hear nature around me, didn't hear a single car :)

@R4gn4r0k: The democratization of knowledge has been a blessing and a curse.

On one hand, making information and knowledge more accessible to everyone has lead to more enlightnement and technial jobs being more accessible to everyone. Remember when I praised MS's influence in gaming? This is my main reason. MS's programs have made game development significantly more accessible to everyone. MS's education programs, toolkits as well as Steam, Desura and XBOX Live Arcade is arguably why the Indie Scene Blew up.

On the not so bright side, it leads to the dunning kruger effect. As well, as con artists and frauds gaining a lot of influence.

I agree that people really are eating their cake and having it too. Which is why I prefer to remain consistant with accepting academic data. Even changing my positions if my positions contradict the data.